Vince how do you feel about Pam and Jim, their relationship?

Post by **wha happened** » Sun Nov 19, 2006 4:31 am

Salli, it's falling on deaf ears. This isn't the LL. Here's a little example, if I told someone or a group of people something in confidence, then the third party questioned me about it, I would probably think about that person's feelings and deny it. You still didn't answer the simple questions, are you calling Frank a liar and when was the last time you spoke to Babe? Just to clear it up, in the 'time' you spent with Jim, in your words was nearly 24/7, you only saw Frank and Jim together once? or you only talked to Frank once? BTW, how about starting a new topic or something, this is Vince's domain. This board was started so we could all get away from the the soap opera atmosphere & lack of actual Doors topics like over at the LL. We have better things to discuss sweetie. I'm glad you and the LL police are on your toes. Personally I have better things to do with my time, but hey. We're still glad to have ya.

Post by **salli** » Sun Nov 19, 2006 4:55 am

jim4371 wrote:You are assuming that anything Frank may have said was a firsthand account.
That is an unreasonable expectation.
Knowing Wha personally, and without giving any further information, I will say that I have absolutely no doubt that anything he says Frank said, Frank said.

Sorry, nice of you to defend your friend, but I'm not buying this load of crap of

I have absolutely no doubt that anything he says Frank said, Frank said.

People have said Frank has said things before and Frank has denied it. People have said that you can take what they say Frank said to the bank. Frank has said they were lying when I talked to him about them.

As I said Frank wasn't there. Frank cannot talk about what happened when Frank wasn't there.

The Frank I know doesn't talk about things he didn't witness personally.
The Frank I know wouldn't talk about my sitting around with Leon at the Doors office waiting for Jim. That Frank would know that I never knew Leon and that Leon had left well before I ever met Jim. That Frank would know that I was a working journalist and way too busy to hang around the Doors office waiting for Jim.

I think the lies about me are due completely to your cowardly friend, who couldn't get his dates or sequences or even person right to save his lying, cowardly, stupid little life.

The reason your friend won't give me his name is because he's afraid that Frank will say your friend is lying.

So once again, your friend is a liar. Your friend is a coward. I suggest you might want to find a better class of friend.

Oh yes, ask him when he last saw Babe Hill.

Post by **salli** » Sun Nov 19, 2006 5:13 am

wha happened wrote:Salli, it's falling on deaf ears. This isn't the LL. Here's a little example, if I told someone or a group of people something in confidence, then the third party questioned me about it, I would probably think about that person's feelings and deny it. You still didn't answer the simple questions, are you calling Frank a liar and when was the last time you spoke to Babe? Just to clear it up, in the 'time' you spent with Jim, in your words was nearly 24/7, you only saw Frank and Jim together once? or you only talked to Frank once? BTW, how about starting a new topic or something, this is Vince's domain. This board was started so we could all get away from the the soap opera atmosphere & lack of actual Doors topics like over at the LL. We have better things to discuss sweetie. I'm glad you and the LL police are on your toes. Personally I have better things to do with my time, but hey. We're still glad to have ya.

Like I said, I'm calling you a liar, not Frank.

Let me emind you, you're the one who started this drama by lying about me in your original post. I guess you thought I'd never see it.

Frank and I don't spare each other's feelings. We never have. Frank was not around. It was me, Jim, and Babe.
So:
1) Yup, I saw talked to Frank once in 1970-71..at a movie with Kathy and Jim.
2) Yup, like I said almost 20/7 from October 17 until October 29. Not 24/7. I have never said 24/7. If you'd paid attention on the LL you'd know that. It's posted.

So's the answer to the Babe Hill question.

Your name? When did you last see Babe...assuming you know him.
This board was started to give Vince a forum for his memories and to have him answer questions and to talk about Jim and the Doors. I knew about this board before you got here.

So you have better things to do? Please go do those better things you have to do and stop blaming Frank for your lies.

Post by **jim4371** » Sun Nov 19, 2006 5:34 am

Oh for Christ's sake.
He never claimed to know Babe, this board was around well before Vince got here, as far as I can immediately recall, you've caught WH in exactly one factual inaccuracy (which you cannot attribute directly to him, especially in context), he is an extremely credible person, and I do not hesitate to stand by his assertions.
He's not some bullshit flake like you-know-who.

Post by **salli** » Sun Nov 19, 2006 8:41 am

TheDoorsMusic wrote:
salli wrote: Nobody asked you for your opinion or your statements and it makes it look like wha happened can't fight his own battles against a crippled 63-year-old woman without your help.

Grow up. Stay out of battles that don't belong to you. You have no place in this one.
I do belong to this battle Salli. You can't come here and think you own the place.

Dan

No one, least of all me, said anything about owning this place.

What you seem to not understand is that I came over here because someone lied about me. Do you really think I'm going to be nice about that? I'm not nice about it on the LL either and I don't own that place either. I get no special treatment on the LL from any of the mods or Dave or Jeff.

now it seems to me from your posts, that you are trying to make this all about you. Well, Dan, it's not about you at all.

It's about me and wha happened and the lie he told about me. That's what this is about. Not you. Not the ownership of this board.

This has absolutely nothing to do with you.

Now if you would like me to come on here and lie about you, than it would be about you.

Would you be nice about someone lying about you. I doubt it.

Like I said, not your business so stay out of it and let wha happened stop acting like a coward by using you as a point man.
I'm going to sleep so good night.

Post by **J.B.Marx** » Sun Nov 19, 2006 11:45 am

Now all say I'm sorry & shake hands...

Post by **Hamlet** » Sun Nov 19, 2006 4:30 pm

- I dig Salli!

She is a very nice and polite woman, who really did spend time with Morrison and made a great interview with him.

I have never bought her views on the sixties and her protesting the fact that Morrison was left alone by a lot of people in the business, when he needed them most.

But, I think they are her views. And she is enitled to these, as I am.

Read what Manzarek has to say about Lisciandro.

Post by **wha happened** » Sun Nov 19, 2006 9:00 pm

Since this thread is already in the shitter, thanks Salli, why not add to it. I'm not using anyone for a point man, how nice of you to think that. It's just people around here might not kiss your ass like at the LL. People can't really speak up over there for fear of getting banned or having the posts deleted. I'm just posting what I was told, I'm not making this stuff up for the hell of it. You said your beef. Call Frank, more power to you. It's easier to dismiss all of this as lies or rumors than to hurt feelings. It's ok for you to totally trash PK on the LL ?, whether people like her or not, let them decide. How many topics are there over at the LL about her? how many did you post in? This wasn't even a topic dedicated to you, but rather a couple paragraphs. How many topics did you trash Steven Davis in? whether he's right or wrong. How many people do you go off on about giving their opinions about Davis or PK? What if there was a whole topic with 20 pages such as this on the LL? think it would get deleted? It's my right to believe or not believe what I'm told or hear. Since you won't tell us the last time you spoke to Babe, are you sure you never met, talked to or seen Leon except for the LL?

Stuart · Post by **Stuart** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 11:03 am

Doors fans IMO should be grateful to salli, janet etc taking time to post on the boards, they DONT HAVE TO but take the time out of their lifes too and share there experiences, through that we learn more about jim and the man he was.

Salli Is a wonderful Lady and when salli says something imo you can take it to the bank as being true what she says.

Salli, In the Words of Tupac Shakur "You Are Appreciated".

Stuart · Post by **Stuart** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 11:08 am

Check out this excellent interview with Frank,check out what frank says about manzarek-

http://www.crystal-ship.com/fan_club.php?act=int-fl1

Im with Frank on this one 8) .

Post by **The Freedom Man** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 12:16 pm

Well, after reading the answers, I welcome Frank here on the Forum.
Seems like an honest, down to earth man, and telling things how they were, not to keep the myth alive.
FREE THE TRUTH

Post by **slimedog** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 4:13 pm

Stuart wrote:Doors fans IMO should be grateful to salli, janet etc taking time to post on the boards, they DONT HAVE TO but take the time out of their lifes too and share there experiences, through that we learn more about jim and the man he was.

Salli Is a wonderful Lady and when salli says something imo you can take it to the bank as being true what she says.

Salli, In the Words of Tupac Shakur "You Are Appreciated".

I'd like to second this sentiment.

Post by **J.B.Marx** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 4:45 pm

Sentiments are bullshit.

Post by **Hamlet** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 6:45 pm

Stuart wrote:Check out this excellent interview with Frank,check out what frank says about manzarek-

http://www.crystal-ship.com/fan_club.php?act=int-fl1

Im with Frank on this one 8) .

lol!- I couldn´t give a shit what Lisciandro feels about Manzarek.

Stuart · Post by **Stuart** » Wed Nov 22, 2006 11:07 am

I do

, Frank's Books on Jim are two of THE best books ever done on Jim imo ,shows jim the man and poet.

Post by **Hamlet** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 5:49 pm

salli wrote:Read the damned timelines and pay attention to them. They are accurate and you might actually learn something.

As your post reads, you imply a lot. In it you seem to claim that you have talked to Frank about me? I doubt that. I think you're nothing but a trouble maker who lies and thinks you can get away with it because you post under an anonymous name and a really stupid looking avatar.

Give me your real name, wha happened. I'll call Frank and check you out with him. I'll ask him what he's said about me to you.

Frank and I went through this once before in the late 1990s and the person had never even contacted Frank, but told me he had and that they were friends. Frank called him the liar. Frank didn't know who the guy was...You maybe?
Leon: Leon quit working for the Doors way before I met Jim. I've never seen Leon in person. Leon and I have never been in the same geographic location at the same time. We met about two years ago on the Doors Board. I've still never seen Leon in person and he couldn't begin to describe me if his life depended on it.

wha happened wrote:Since you won't tell us the last time you spoke to Babe, are you sure you never met, talked to or seen Leon except for the LL?

So, why isn´t Salli answering wha happened´s question?

Wow!

Post by **salli** » Sun Dec 03, 2006 6:20 pm

Why, Hamlet? Because it's a stupid question.

My question would be why does wha happened want to know and what does he think he's going to prove by knowing what others have had access to for years on the LL.

I remember I posted it when someone named Indian Swirl started attacking me in the same a' hole "knows it all, knows nothing" way. Wonder if they are related.

The fact is if wha happened actually knew Frank as well as he claimed, wha happened would know the answer, or he could just call Frank up and ask, unless of course it's too expensive to call.

Stuart · Post by **Stuart** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 11:34 am

And Please Lay Off the Lady.

Post by **J.B.Marx** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 7:33 pm

Ah Stuart get your head out!

Stuart · Post by **Stuart** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 11:18 am

What Exactly are you alleging?.

Post by **J.B.Marx** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 6:05 pm

Just read the comments you posted in this topic and you know what I mean.

Stuart · Post by **Stuart** » Thu Dec 07, 2006 11:29 am

Well I dont, So if you could Please be more specific!!!!.

Post by **windchime** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 5:16 pm

I would be curious why some here do not get that salli actually knew these people?? Why the attacks?? Even when you get someone that knew them, you attack them (except Vince who seesm to claim he knew more that I believe he did) which I notice is absent from this berading?? I can read and she was calling Wha the lar, not Frank. Get over it and move on!!

PS. If someone is being called a liar as salli has been (and more), they have the right to say whatever they choose. I don't give a damn how long Wha, Stuart, etc have been here, she has the right to speak her mind just as you do.

Thanks~

Post by **The Freedom Man** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 5:54 pm

Cut it out Windchime, no need to start another fire here

Concerning Vince, He's very busy with work and will reply more when he has more time, that's all.

Post by **windchime** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 7:18 pm

I am not starting anything?? I am simply making a very clear observation. As for Vince, I don't really care what he is doing or where he is (just another observation as I have been the victim of his attacks). I just find it interesting that after months of me being totally absent, nothing has changed. I say stop attacking each other and I get jumped on, go figure.

Post by **The Freedom Man** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 7:31 pm

The "salli issue" is long over, no need to bring that up anymore.
Other then that, Merry X-mas.

Post by **windchime** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 8:15 pm

thefreed wrote:The "salli issue" is long over, no need to bring that up anymore.
Other then that, Merry X-mas.

Merry Christmas to you as well.

Post by **adam** » Tue Dec 26, 2006 10:39 am

[ok i've just trawled thru this entire thread & i'm gonna try & get it back on topic...]

Vince's comments on Pam are not disimilar to kennealy's comments on P in her book.... (and NO i'm not saying this makes K's book a bible of truth)

People SEEM to queue up to rubbish kennealy but that doesn't mean Jim didn't slag off pam to her

I think often when humans are in 'love' a "better the devil you know" feeling can can immerge (typical examples are, ppl struggling to leave violent lovers or ppl pining for the ex-ex after the current ends or even a desire not to tear it all down & start over)

I think events happened with Jim & Pam & then we've all tried to make our reasons for it,

eg

FACT

Pam went to paris 1st & jim came along later to they could be away from the states together

WHY?

option1 = Jim deeply loved pam, everyday they were parted he ached counting the days until they could be together & in their idyllic french apartment, renewing their relationship & fighting their collect addictions

option2 = The US had worn Jim down (we all know why) he wasn't massively happy with Pam, but all other women had been much more demanding & 'better the devil you know' when going to a strange new country, besides perhaps things would be better there..

option3 = thinking "screw going to prison" ol Jimbo new he had to do the offski from the states to safer shores. Sending his useless junk riddled biatch accross the pond was a master stroke, not only could she use that pre-jim arriving time to sort out a place to live & get coozy & familar with Paris, it mainly meant that ol Jimbo would have few weeks of quality time w/out the dizzy tiresome cow he'd been so unable to get rid of...

Now i'm goona be a big man and admit i made the above up & cant say its true.

i also doubt its even that black & white

BUT the point i wanna make is the facts we know are facts, but reasoning we put behind them is fantasy...

===========

I aggree with Vince that ppl are obessed with J+P love story (& yes mainly girls).

It's like ppl cant accept that maybe just MAYBE Jim didn't make a particularly good choice with women.. Hey poet, philosophizer, super-hot pin up guy, great singer, song writer, chart toper, rock icon et al but maybe just MAYBE not so good at picking partners....

man Jim might come to your house, meet your partner (who must by ALL accounts be a nicer person than Pam) & say

"fuck man, i'd swap it all for what you have"

================

Last one, i promise..

if i was Jim in my little openin scanerio, then my answer would be a combination of Options 1,2 & 3.... & i gotta say that perhaps Jim's would have been too.

================

So in summary

- no one to my mind from the doors circle has ever really said good things about Pam

- that fact Pam has issues doesn't mean Jim didn't love her

- that fact Pam has issues doesn't mean Jim did love her

- love is a complicated & personal thing & being hot, talented rock star, doesn't make it so that good love will come easy...

===========

perhaps, just perhaps - that 99% of women Jim met, simply wanted the patronage of his celebraty status, the contents of his bank account & lifetime's worth of morrison's-got-a-big-cock stories.

so why go with Pam?

well didn't she be like the 1st person to see he was gonna have all that shit? maybe he spent his time thinking 'well at least Pam was my groupie b4 i was even porperly famous'

gotta count for something.

==========

THANKS FOR THIS SITE VINCE

Post by **Dragonfly** » Fri Aug 05, 2011 10:25 am