The "lost" pre-Elektra 1966 Love album

Post by **Chris M** » Thu Dec 16, 2010 7:09 am

This has to be one of the biggest rock and roll 'holy grails' out there. The thought of an unheard early version of the album recorded at Gold Star with Hal Blaine on drums boggles the mind.

I was wondering if anyone has an idea when/where the tapes were lost? There is so much long lost vault material that has turned up I can't help but hope this is out there somewhere.

Thanks to Johnny and Michael for taking the time to chat. It's a thrill to get to talk to guys that played on some of the best rock records ever put down on wax.

thanks!
Chris

Post by **Johnny Echols** » Thu Dec 16, 2010 8:52 am

Chris M wrote:This has to be one of the biggest rock and roll 'holy grails' out there. The thought of an unheard early version of the album recorded at Gold Star with Hal Blaine on drums boggles the mind.

I was wondering if anyone has an idea when/where the tapes were lost? There is so much long lost vault material that has turned up I can't help but hope this is out there somewhere.

Thanks to Johnny and Michael for taking the time to chat. It's a thrill to get to talk to guys that played on some of the best rock records ever put down on wax.

thanks!
Chris

Thank you for your kind words. Jerry Hopkins had the tapes in early 1965. He took them somewhere to have copies made, and somehow they were misplaced. It really is too bad, those sessions were way better than the ones done at Sunset Sound. They're probably sitting in a dusty old box in a garage some where in the valley, waiting to be discovered. One never knows! JE.

Post by **BallroomDays67** » Thu Dec 16, 2010 5:29 pm

I find it surprising that there's no mention of the Gold Star recordings in the Einarson book. It's mentioned that the sessions for the debut album went quickly, and that's attributed to Love having mastered those songs through performing them live. However, they had also been previously recorded in the studio. It seems like a major oversight on the part of the author.

Post by **Johnny Echols** » Thu Dec 16, 2010 6:50 pm

BallroomDays67 wrote:I find it surprising that there's no mention of the Gold Star recordings in the Einarson book. It's mentioned that the sessions for the debut album went quickly, and that's attributed to Love having mastered those songs through performing them live. However, they had also been previously recorded in the studio. It seems like a major oversight on the part of the author.

Not Really, it was widely known that we had recorded another version of the first Love album at Goldstar. We briefly discussed the matter, so Einarson was aware of the Jerry Hopkins sessions. But since they were "lost", and very few people other than the group actually heard them, the whole experience is probably better left as a footnote. JE.

Post by **jim4371** » Thu Dec 16, 2010 7:09 pm

Forgive my ignorance, but is this the same Jerry Hopkins I'm thinking of, Mark?

Post by **BallroomDays67** » Thu Dec 16, 2010 7:16 pm

Yes, it is. I was surprised too.

Post by **jim4371** » Thu Dec 16, 2010 7:22 pm

I knew he had a history of losing things, but not producing records

Post by **Johnny Echols** » Thu Dec 16, 2010 8:03 pm

jim4371 wrote:Forgive my ignorance, but is this the same Jerry Hopkins I'm thinking of, Mark?

The Writer? Yes it is! We knew nothing about him at the time, other than he had connections at Columbia Records, and wanted to manage Love. This would have been very early on. We went to Goldstar and completed a demo, when [he] lost the tapes, [we] "lost" interest...!!! JE.

Post by **jim4371** » Thu Dec 16, 2010 8:12 pm

strange, strange, strange..

Post by **Roughie** » Thu Dec 16, 2010 8:35 pm

Now I think he's an even bigger ass!

Post by **BallroomDays67** » Tue Dec 28, 2010 10:56 pm

As best you can, what was the track listing of the Gold Star demo? Am I correct in assuming that "Signed D.C." was written after Don Conka had left the group? In the Einarson book, Arthur mentions that it was written after one of Love's Hullabaloo shows, but I'm not sure when that particular show took place.

Post by **Silver Forest** » Wed Dec 29, 2010 5:21 pm

Johnny Echols wrote:
jim4371 wrote:Forgive my ignorance, but is this the same Jerry Hopkins I'm thinking of, Mark?

The Writer? Yes it is! We knew nothing about him at the time, other than he had connections at Columbia Records, and wanted to manage Love. This would have been very early on. We went to Goldstar and completed a demo, when [he] lost the tapes, [we] "lost" interest...!!! JE.

As Chris mentioned, quite an weird story. Things are quite different today. I can imagine the legal implications of such a loss in a scenario of today's industry...

Post by **jamestkirk** » Wed Dec 29, 2010 5:42 pm

There are so many stories of lost master tapes, including Forever Changes; Eric Anderson's masterpiece that was not uncovered for 30 years and released as STAGES: THE LOST ALBUM; Buckingham Nicks only LP.....

So many

Post by **Silver Forest** » Wed Dec 29, 2010 6:13 pm

jamestkirk wrote:There are so many stories of lost master tapes, including Forever Changes; Eric Anderson's masterpiece that was not uncovered for 30 years and released as STAGES: THE LOST ALBUM; Buckingham Nicks only LP.....

So many

Do fans dream of lost tapes?

Yes, they do...

Post by **Johnny Echols** » Wed Dec 29, 2010 7:16 pm

jamestkirk wrote:There are so many stories of lost master tapes, including Forever Changes; Eric Anderson's masterpiece that was not uncovered for 30 years and released as STAGES: THE LOST ALBUM; Buckingham Nicks only LP.....

So many

There being lost "Master" tapes of Forever Changes is true. If anything defines our relationship with Elektra, it's the lax attitude they had concerning our work product. Not only did they lose the "Master's," they lost dozens of hours of working tapes, with all of the alternate take's, and different treatments. It would have been a fascinating look into the creative process, with some definite surprises. Too bad!! The bloom had most definitely left the rose! JE.

Post by **Silver Forest** » Wed Dec 29, 2010 8:38 pm

Unfortunately, LoVE was not the only great band to be affected.

Something went wrong with Elektra's archives in those days. There are some stories about Doors studio session tapes (Morrison Hotel period) being rescued by strangers from Elektra's thrash. A member of this forum told us something about it in the past. Since it's a mystery what The Doors still keep in their archives, we don't know exactly what was lost or is in the hands of strangers.

Like what happened with LoVE, this is a surreal and a real painful situation for the fans. I have to be honest saying that I always loved to listen to some bootlegs bringing us some alternative/outtakes of great songs. Although often not very accurate in terms of track related info or chronology, they provide us some glimpses of that creative process you mentioned. And that is really fascinating to listen.

I think bands should always provide the fans this type of products. Much like the bonus DVDs of the behind the scenes of many great films that come with Deluxe editions.

Post by **BallroomDays67** » Wed Dec 29, 2010 8:58 pm

It's great to hear the band having fun in what little we do have from the "Forever Changes" working tapes. I love take one of "Hillside", which is hilarious, and turns into a fun version of "Wooly Bully."

Post by **Johnny Echols** » Wed Dec 29, 2010 10:06 pm

BallroomDays67 wrote:It's great to hear the band having fun in what little we do have from the "Forever Changes" working tapes. I love take one of "Hillside", which is hilarious, and turns into a fun version of "Wooly Bully."

That's one of the things many people don't realize. We really enjoyed making music, and hanging-out, together. Contrary to some of what's been written by one Mr. Alban "Snoopy" Phisterer, we actually liked each other. As is obvious from the out-takes, we had fun in the studio. Most of our "problems" surfaced [after] the group were no longer playing together. JE.

Post by **jamestkirk** » Thu Dec 30, 2010 5:52 pm

It always surprises me to hear Snoop trash Arthur-who seemed to really love Snoopy from all I have seen of clips of Arthur. Even after Snoopy-the-drummer was no longer considered able to rise to the new material for Da Capo, Arthur found a way to keep him on the keyboards. Honestly-- what an honor--for a temporary "sit-in" artist-to make it onto two iconic albums of the 1960's and to have those memories of Bido Lito's and the Whiskey, and the friendship of Arthur (who did not make friends lightly). Really---does it get any better? Michael talks affectionately & with respect of Snoopy & compliments his drumming which seems to have improved quite a bit over time, actually. Maybe I don't have the full picture.

...I just don't get it....maybe Snoop is just naturally a malcontent....

Post by **Johnny Echols** » Thu Dec 30, 2010 9:43 pm

jamestkirk wrote:It always surprises me to hear Snoop trash Arthur-who seemed to really love Snoopy from all I have seen of clips of Arthur. Even after Snoopy-the-drummer was no longer considered able to rise to the new material for Da Capo, Arthur found a way to keep him on the keyboards. Honestly-- what an honor--for a temporary "sit-in" artist-to make it onto two iconic albums of the 1960's and to have those memories of Bido Lito's and the Whiskey, and the friendship of Arthur (who did not make friends lightly). Really---does it get any better? Michael talks affectionately & with respect of Snoopy & compliments his drumming which seems to have improved quite a bit over time, actually. Maybe I don't have the full picture.

...I just don't get it....maybe Snoop is just naturally a malcontent....

I don't think I will ever understand where "Snoopy" was coming from. As far as I know, he was treated well by everyone. Arthur liked him, and included him in everything! He was made aware from day one, that his position was temporary. We kept him in the group, long after it no longer made sense, musically or financially. He was very young emotionally, and was socially uncomfortable. We had very little in common with him. The only significant interaction I can recall having with "Snoopy," was when he hooked me up, with a beautiful six foot five inch model from Germany, who didn't speak a word of English. She was "memorable,"

Mr. Phisterer wasn't! JE.

The "lost" pre-Elektra 1966 Love album

The "lost" pre-Elektra 1966 Love album

Re: The "lost" pre-Elektra 1966 Love album