The Doors Forum

Love, The Monkees, and many other groups were very active in the social network of the Laurel Canyon culture back in the day.

I love the very underrated Monkees who got a really bad rap by the press back in the day. They were and are a very talented group of musicians that had the unfortunate fate of being placed under the thumb of of a control freak producer (who later went on to form a group he could easily have complete control over--an imaginary bubblegum band made up totally of session guys --called The Archies. Bleah!).

As the Monkees broke free from their chains, so then did the label stop their support...& as their albums became more creative, culminating in their cult classic HEAD, their popularity waned.

Did you know any of them or jam at all with any member of the Monkees? Papa Nez-Michael Nesmith is an all time favorite of mine.

lk

I watched Head last night!

Roughie wrote:I watched Head last night!

Isn't it great?! We are on the same page, roughie! Freaks in arms! ("freaks" is a good thing!)

jamestkirk wrote:

Roughie wrote:I watched Head last night!

Isn't it great?! We are on the same page, roughie! Freaks in arms! ("freaks" is a good thing!)

That it is. I can see how much of a slap in the face to those involved in creating the Monkees it must have been.

Yup we sure are two freaks.

Sorry, I didn't know the Monkees, accept I believe it was Peter Tork, or it could have been Mike Nesmith, who came up to my house with Scotty, and promptly took off all of his clothes. I dug their music, but I thought the exhibitionism thing was a tad over the top. Arthur and I both, could be a bit prudish about certain things! Anyway who wants to see some dude walking around his house naked? I'm just saying!!! JE.

jamestkirk wrote:Love, The Monkees, and many other groups were very active in the social network of the Laurel Canyon culture back in the day.

I love the very underrated Monkees who got a really bad rap by the press back in the day. They were and are a very talented group of musicians that had the unfortunate fate of being placed under the thumb of of a control freak producer (who later went on to form a group he could easily have complete control over--an imaginary bubblegum band made up totally of session guys --called The Archies. Bleah!).

As the Monkees broke free from their chains, so then did the label stop their support...& as their albums became more creative, culminating in their cult classic HEAD, their popularity waned.

Did you know any of them or jam at all with any member of the Monkees? Papa Nez-Michael Nesmith is an all time favorite of mine.

lk

No question to ask, just wanted to put in my two cents. I'd put "Pisces, Aquarius" and "Head" against anything in that day and I think they hold up very well by themselves. The Monkees, in their idiom, were quite representative of the rebelliousness of the times.

silentseason wrote:

jamestkirk wrote:Love, The Monkees, and many other groups were very active in the social network of the Laurel Canyon culture back in the day.

I love the very underrated Monkees who got a really bad rap by the press back in the day. They were and are a very talented group of musicians that had the unfortunate fate of being placed under the thumb of of a control freak producer (who later went on to form a group he could easily have complete control over--an imaginary bubblegum band made up totally of session guys --called The Archies. Bleah!).

As the Monkees broke free from their chains, so then did the label stop their support...& as their albums became more creative, culminating in their cult classic HEAD, their popularity waned.

Did you know any of them or jam at all with any member of the Monkees? Papa Nez-Michael Nesmith is an all time favorite of mine.

lk

No question to ask, just wanted to put in my two cents. I'd put "Pisces, Aquarius" and "Head" against anything in that day and I think they hold up very well by themselves. The Monkees, in their idiom, were quite representative of the rebelliousness of the times.

Right...and Headquarters is a favorite too....

this from wiki...




After the end of their relationship with Kirshner, the Monkees went into 'Goldstar Studios' in Hollywood determined to prove to the world that they were a bonafide group, and could play their own instruments. What resulted was Headquarters, with all four Monkees in the studio, now together at the same time, with very few guest musicians. Produced by Chip Douglas and issued in May 1967, the four Monkees wrote and played on much of their own material. Nearly all vocals and instruments on Headquarters were performed by the four Monkees (the exceptions being few, usually by producer Chip Douglas on bass). The album shot to number one, but was quickly eclipsed the following week by a milestone cultural event when The Beatles released Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band.

jamestkirk wrote:

silentseason wrote:

jamestkirk wrote:Love, The Monkees, and many other groups were very active in the social network of the Laurel Canyon culture back in the day.

I love the very underrated Monkees who got a really bad rap by the press back in the day. They were and are a very talented group of musicians that had the unfortunate fate of being placed under the thumb of of a control freak producer (who later went on to form a group he could easily have complete control over--an imaginary bubblegum band made up totally of session guys --called The Archies. Bleah!).

As the Monkees broke free from their chains, so then did the label stop their support...& as their albums became more creative, culminating in their cult classic HEAD, their popularity waned.

Did you know any of them or jam at all with any member of the Monkees? Papa Nez-Michael Nesmith is an all time favorite of mine.

lk

No question to ask, just wanted to put in my two cents. I'd put "Pisces, Aquarius" and "Head" against anything in that day and I think they hold up very well by themselves. The Monkees, in their idiom, were quite representative of the rebelliousness of the times.

Right...and Headquarters is a favorite too....

this from wiki...




After the end of their relationship with Kirshner, the Monkees went into 'Goldstar Studios' in Hollywood determined to prove to the world that they were a bonafide group, and could play their own instruments. What resulted was Headquarters, with all four Monkees in the studio, now together at the same time, with very few guest musicians. Produced by Chip Douglas and issued in May 1967, the four Monkees wrote and played on much of their own material. Nearly all vocals and instruments on Headquarters were performed by the four Monkees (the exceptions being few, usually by producer Chip Douglas on bass). The album shot to number one, but was quickly eclipsed the following week by a milestone cultural event when The Beatles released Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band.

I would have put "Headquarters" in there as well (it was certainly their most group effort and the result of their breaking free) except that the production wasn't nearly as crisp as the other two. Randy Scouse Git and For Pete's Sake are two of my favorites. Also I think you could put Nez's early solo albums (particularly Nevada Fighter to me) as some of the best that country rock offered from that era.

You guys have said it all, I loved the Monkees music. I have always felt that producers should do whatever it is they do, and leave the music to to the musicians! From my perspective, with very few exceptions, they only get in the way!!!

Johnny Echols wrote:You guys have said it all, I loved the Monkees music. I have always felt that producers should do whatever it is they do, and leave the music to to the musicians! From my perspective, with very few exceptions, they only get in the way!!!

Totally agree. I think that this ties in with the group ethos that Mr. Echols has offered in other threads. When the Monkees tried to operate as a full unit (the three albums mentioned), the outcome soared miles above the music that was put out when they just 4 individuals operating under the blanket of a group name creating essentially solo music.

Same for Love. I think the playing of the post-FC Love was certainly honorable, but the output was clearly lacking that undefineable fire.

I think it goes for anything in the arts: there is that core group with it's unique vision. If the core is divided or a 2nd or 3rd person puts their intrepretation in the product then what you get isn't the pristine, unmarred truth.

The Monkees were certainly competent musicians when they made those records, but in my opinion their music sounds better when it was recorded in conjunction with studio musicians. In that sense, they were the opposite of Love. The Monkees apparently realized this after making "Headquarters", and went back to using studio musicians to some degree. Their strength was in the top-notch songwriting and vocals (particularly Micky's).

While Love had the same strengths, their music in general is more fully realized because of the additional combination of excellent musicianship and, as Johnny has mentioned, the level of their collaborative ability to craft and perfect the songs.